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Style Scenario: What to wear to a Smart Casual job interview

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    #16
    Just one guy's perspective but I only went to the article after this thread reached a couple pages ... I was wondering what could generate that kind of conversation. On a quick glance, I didn't think the fit was that bad, as the pants weren't clinging to his calves (a problem with athletic builds). I see the concerns noted, but I wonder how often those would be noticed in a real life scenario versus a picture that can be get analyzed up and down in detail? Do you all think these items would be that noticed. To me too tight fit is when you can def see the outline of the quad. Noticeably I don't go looking into other men's crotches for fit haha

    The reason I ask is because it really is a struggle to find any sort of pants that fit my legs and with suits the drop is 40/32 for me which either means a lot of tailoring or trying to find a good fit (but noticeably not an ideal fit). I would've looked at that picture and thought for the pants a fine fit on quick glance. Something that is probably pretty similar to what I have.

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      #17
      Originally posted by julius12 View Post
      Yeah the clothes are too tight and it's not a good look.

      Actually, it's not just the clothes. I know it's objective, but muscles that big are just not aesthetically pleasing to look at anymore, especially when fully clothed as you'll just look fat, or muscled fat. I think the sweet spot is between Ryan Reynolds at the skinniest and Hugh Jackman at the bulkiest.
      But also at some point functionality/health is also a factor. Not everything with muscles is strictly looks.

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        #18
        Originally posted by julius12 View Post
        Yeah the clothes are too tight and it's not a good look.

        Actually, it's not just the clothes. I know it's objective, but muscles that big are just not aesthetically pleasing to look at anymore, especially when fully clothed as you'll just look fat, or muscled fat. I think the sweet spot is between Ryan Reynolds at the skinniest and Hugh Jackman at the bulkiest.
        jesus dude, that was harsh

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          #19
          Originally posted by hockeysc23 View Post
          Just one guy's perspective but I only went to the article after this thread reached a couple pages ... I was wondering what could generate that kind of conversation. On a quick glance, I didn't think the fit was that bad, as the pants weren't clinging to his calves (a problem with athletic builds). I see the concerns noted, but I wonder how often those would be noticed in a real life scenario versus a picture that can be get analyzed up and down in detail? Do you all think these items would be that noticed. To me too tight fit is when you can def see the outline of the quad. Noticeably I don't go looking into other men's crotches for fit haha

          The reason I ask is because it really is a struggle to find any sort of pants that fit my legs and with suits the drop is 40/32 for me which either means a lot of tailoring or trying to find a good fit (but noticeably not an ideal fit). I would've looked at that picture and thought for the pants a fine fit on quick glance. Something that is probably pretty similar to what I have.
          IMO the pants are just snug, but the jacket is too small. I feel with more casual items there is a broader spectrum of what is a fit preference, in terms of loose or snug, and what just doesn’t fit very well. With casual items there is more room to be more body-conscious and form-fitting or, on the other side, more slouchy and relaxed, depending on your preference. With tailored items there is still a spectrum of fit but the spectrum is a bit narrower. I feel he definitely needs a size bigger and potentially a size longer, as both the stance and the overall jacket length seem a bit short.

          My opinion is shaped by my general mindset on the idea that in any given outfit, the formality level of different items should generally be cohesive and congruent.... and my resulting dislike of the ever-popular "business mullet." These snug jeans would probably look great paired with a fitted henley for casual wear on the more form-fitting, physique-revealing end of the fit spectrum. If he’s going to wear a tailored jacket, on the other hand, not only should the jacket itself fit well, but he also pair it with an appropriate trouser. I would think at least a chino but maybe even a wool trouser, which would demand a slightly more relaxed and conservative fit to drape appropriately.

          I say this recognizing that perfect fit is always aspirational, and that even great fit can be beyond reach for those of us with unusual body types and limited access to MTM options or skilled tailors. I am typically quite content to settle for just good fit, which would probably not hold up very well to online criticism, but gets me through my day-to-day life feeling confident about how I'm presenting myself. My main takeaway from the posted outfit is to confirm my thoughts about the importance of maintaining congruence in an outfit, which in this case would probably require swapping out the trousers for something a little more formal or else swapping out the top and shoes for something more informal.
          Ben

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            #20
            Originally posted by whereismurder View Post
            jesus dude, that was harsh
            Poor Jason P.

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              #21
              [MENTION=2341]LesserBlackDog[/MENTION] ... good answer. Thanks. I was focusing just on the pants but I think you make some very interesting points. I thought those were a stretch type chino not jeans though?

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                #22
                Right, subjective, not objective. I posted before sleeping and my brain was lazy.

                Gymnasts look jacked as hell (but still with good proportions) and they're amazingly strong carrying and swinging their whole bodyweight. I think that's the maximum size I would aim for, and any more strength than that is not really useful in real life.

                Being the size of powerlifters or strongmen, sure you have power but you give up a lot, and it takes a lot to maintain that muscle. Just look at how the really muscled guys in the UFC perform regardless of weight class. They're not as agile and they gas quick.

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                  #23
                  Originally posted by hockeysc23 View Post
                  [MENTION=2341]LesserBlackDog[/MENTION] ... good answer. Thanks. I was focusing just on the pants but I think you make some very interesting points. I thought those were a stretch type chino not jeans though?
                  I clicked through the link and it looks like they are a 5-pocket jean style pant.
                  Ben

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                    #24
                    Let's keep this discussion on fit and not trailing off into preferred body type. People have different goals in life which require different body types but relating this back to fit, we want people to look put together.

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                      #25
                      I've noticed the same thing about fit in Dappered photos every once in a while. The idea of clothes that skim your body or your frame is mentioned regularly, but it's not always there in practice. Mainly I see it in pants that are too tight around the thighs and waist, with wrinkles from knee to ankle. Sometimes in tops as well, though.

                      This may just be an issue of clothes that need to be returned, but I think it's perfectly fine to mention such shortcomings of fit. Some men --- not me, of course :-) --- find tightness in other areas; it's good to have an idea about what's passable and what might be improved.

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                        #26
                        Originally posted by LesserBlackDog View Post
                        Originally posted by julius12 View Post
                        Yeah the clothes are too tight and it's not a good look.

                        Actually, it's not just the clothes. I know it's objective, but muscles that big are just not aesthetically pleasing to look at anymore, especially when fully clothed as you'll just look fat, or muscled fat. I think the sweet spot is between Ryan Reynolds at the skinniest and Hugh Jackman at the bulkiest.

                        "Subjective" is the word you're looking for, and you're right, it is highly subjective. As someone who follows a lot of Olympic lifters and powerlifters, these days I am a lot more impressed by bodies that look functional and powerful (like Jason P's) and a lot less impressed by conventionally "aesthetic" bodies who look to me like their tiny waists and legs would crumple under a heavy load.

                        I look at a lot of bodies I used to find impressive and now just see someone who has been calorie-restricted and dehydrated to get their bodyfat to an unsustainably low level just to show a little muscular definition in their torso for a scene in a movie.
                        Fun bit of trivia: Ben, what you call "conventionally aesthetic," and what Julius is probably alluding to, is a relatively recent phenomenon: the style was popularized by Joe Weider in the 1950s as part of a cynical effort at bypassing obscenity laws that existed back then and selling badly-produced erotica to a horribly persecuted gay community that was trapped in the shadows and had no other options/outlets. Before him and his tremendously successful marketing efforts, Bob Hoffman and his stable of internationally competitive weightlifters set the standard for "conventionally aesthetic," big shoulders and thighs and thick torsos and all. But Hoffman lived and breathed weightlifting and wasn't as good a marketer, and after the 1960s with the rise of the Eastern European powers, our weightlifting teams weren't successful internationally anyway, so bodybuilding became the dominant muscle contest, and it would be 60+ years before Greg Glassman, a great marketer despite his many obvious flaws, and his CF buddies showed up to bring proper barbell sport, and the bodies that come with that game, back to the fore.

                        But enough physical culture trivia. To address the topic, I am actually shaped kind of like Jason P (5'9" 220lbs, mostly in my shoulders and butt), and it is true that I cannot just blindly follow #menswear conventions the way a 5'11" 165lb guy in a 38R jacket, 33x32 slim fit pants, and size M for everything else can, but I would certainly hope I am not categorized as "just not aesthetically pleasing to look at anymore, especially when fully clothed as you'll just look fat, or muscled fat." The obvious trick is to make sure your clothes work with your bulk, not against it. Most meatheads either 1. size up their clothes for "comfort," so lots of XL t-shirts and polos and Levis 559 relaxed fit jeans which together yield a general sense of billowy shapelessness, or 2. size down their clothes thinking that that way they avoid the fat-guy look, but this just ends up making them look lumpy and out of proportion.

                        As with most things, I've found the solution is to go to the happy medium, so that you can let your gainzzz talk quietly, without letting them dominate your appearance and send the wrong message. You want to bring some presence into the room that a thin guy cannot, but in a subtle way that doesn't bring any negative connotations associated with it. The Rock, for example, I think is quite good at this, as are most of the recently retired players talking on NFL Sunday shows. For me personally, I like soft-shouldered jackets, which toe the line between the hard-shouldered linebacker look you can get if you regularly press and jerk, and totally unstructured, which can overly reveal all your swole. Once upon a time I asked for as much waist suppression as I could get, until it looked like a corset, but now I am all about just a slight nip, and again letting the shoulders speak for themselves. The arms, if the I cannot properly bend my elbows all the way without fabric pulling, it's too much. My favorite jackets are MTM, with a biggish sleeve shoved into a smaller armhole. I've slowly moved away from my SuSu jackets, because the smaller armholes feel good but they accompanying small sleeves look what you sometimes see on an NFL rookie defensive lineman who just bought his first real suit.

                        For pants, I prefer higher rise trousers in wool flannel for winter and tropical worsted for summer, with a single pleat and full cut, because they tend to drape cleanly whereas cotton pants can easily snag on your thighs and calves, even when you don't get them in slim. Lower rise stuff tends to pool around my butt and let my shirt come untucked, which gets annoying. My favorite shoes are probably my MacNeils, which again bring some balance to my overall heftiness without going into Alden territory, as opposed to some Blake stitched Magnanni, which make me look like I'm standing on twinkletoes. Shirts, polos, henleys, etc. are kind of straightforward: properly fitted in the shoulders and slimmish but not overly so in the midsection.

                        Iono, that's my 2c, anyway....For all I know I've just been looking "muscled fat" this whole time....
                        Last edited by stuffedsuperdud; February 27, 2020, 09:43 PM.

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                          #27
                          His body looks fine; he just needs clothes that fit properly.

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