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Official Bourbon/Rye Thread

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  • emynd
    replied
    I stumbled across this Whiskey Tree that the good folks at the straightbourbon forums (http://www.straightbourbon.com/forums/) put together. Printable Excel file can be found at the bottom of this page. Pretty awesome:

    Whiskey Tree, 5.2
    Note: These tree is only a breakdown of "macro" distillers

    Barton-1792, #3 char, Independent Stave
    Barton (75/15/10)- Very Old Barton all proofs +???
    1792 (high barley?)- 1792 Ridgemont Reserve, +???
    Other Bourbons: Tom Moore BiB, Kentucky Gentleman, Kentucky Tavern, Ten High, Walker's Delluxe, other "cats & dogs".The rest, unknown
    Rye 37/53/10? (speculation based on label of High West Double Rye!)- Fleischman's Rye
    Before it was purchased by Sazerac, sold to a lot of NDPs.


    Beam, #4 char, Independent Stave
    Beam Mashbill (76/13/10)- all JB bourbons, Old Crow, Old Taylor*, Knob Creek, Baker's, Booker's
    Old Grandad Mashbill (63/27/10)- OGD, Basil Hayden
    Rye- JB Rye, Old Overholt, RiĀ¹, Knob Creek Rye

    Brown-Forman, #3 char, Brown-Forman Cooperage
    Old Forester (72/18/10)- Old Forester, Woodford Reserve
    Early Times (79/11/10)
    Jack Daniels (80/8/12)
    Rye (see Heaven Hill below)- Current source of Heaven Hill's Pikeville and Rittenhouse ryes.
    Also sells to many NDPs.


    Buffalo Trace, #4 char, Independent Stave
    #1, higher corn BT White Dog, Benchmark, Buffalo Trace, Old Charter, Eagle Rare, Col. E.H. Taylor, Geo. T. Stagg
    #2, lower corn- Ancient Age*, Elmer T. Lee*, Hancock*, Blanton's*, Rock Hill Farms*, Virginia Gentleman/Bowman Bourbons?
    Wheat bourbon: Everything Weller, Van Winkle Special Reserve "Lot B"*, Old Rip Van Winkle*, Pappy Van Winkle 15 y/o*
    Rye: Sazerac, Bowman Rye, Van Winkle Family Reserve Rye* (?)

    Diageo, char #3, Indpendent Stave
    Dickel (80/12/8)George Dickel, Cascade Hollow

    Four Roses, #3.5 char, Independent Stave
    Has 2 mashbills and 5 yeasts.
    All Ten Combinations- Four Roses (yellow label)
    OBSK, OBSO, OESK, OESO- Four Roses Small Batch
    OBSV- Four Roses Single Barrel
    All the combinations are also available as Single Barrel, Barrel Strength retailer bottlings.

    Also sells whiskey to Diageo that goes into Bulleit (from the high rye OBS recipes) and I.W. Harper (not available in the U.S.)
    and produces the overseas version of McKenna. For more information, including mashbills, see Oscar's chart here.

    Heaven Hill, #3 char, Indpendent Stave
    Rye Bourbon (75/13/12)- Heaven Hill, J.T.S. Brown, T.W. Samuels, Evan Williams, Elijah Craig, Henry McKenna (U.S.),
    Parker's Heritage (except for 2010), etc. Also probably the source of Luxco's Ezra Brooks line and the current Yellowstone.
    Wheat Bourbon- Old Fitzgerald, Parker's Heritage 2010. Also probably the source of Luxco's Rebel Yell and Rebel Reserve.
    Wheat Whiskey- Bernheim Original
    Rye Whiskey (37/51/12, aprox.)**- Future source of Rittenhouse 80 & BiB, Stephen Foster, current source of Pikesville, Rittenhouse 21 & 23 (?)
    Corn Whiskey: Mellow Corn, JW Corn, Georgia Moon, Dixie Dew, Platte Valley*
    Also sells to many NDPs.

    LDI, ??? char, Independent Stave?
    Sells bourbon and rye for many brands including Templeton, Redemption et al, High West, W.H. Harrison, Cougar (Australia), Bulleit Rye and KBD.
    For a breakdown of the of corn, rye and bourbon whiskey mashbills used, see the MGP website: http://www.mgpingredients.com/product-list/

    Maker's Mark, #3 char, Independent Stave
    Maker's Mark (70/16/14)

    Wild Turkey, #4 "the heavy char", Independent Stave
    Bourbon (75/13/12)- Wild Turkey, Russell's Reserve Bourbon
    Rye (37/51/12, aprox.)**- Wild Turkey Rye, Russell's Reserve Rye


    Brands on the market with whiskey from closed distilleries:
    Medley Rye- Older bottlings of Hirsch, post-PA Michter's(?), Black Maple Hill rye, others?
    Mix of Medley Rye and Cream of Kentucky rye (Bernheim distillery)- Van Winkle Family Reserve Rye.
    Stitzel-Weller bourbon- Pappy Van Winkle (20 & 23 only?), Jefferson's Reserve 17, 18, Vintage 17 etc

    Leave a comment:


  • Brent k
    replied
    I have not tried Buffalo Trace yet. After reading this thread probably going to try more Four Roses small batch offerings.

    Leave a comment:


  • yoyorobbo
    replied
    Originally posted by Brent k View Post
    Pretty sure I want to try Maker's Mark 46. Any reviews here on it?
    Joe has covered it on the main site before:

    http://dappered.com/2011/12/the-12-d...whisky-stones/
    http://dappered.com/tag/makers-46/

    Not seeing the other post in which I (think I) recall him featuring/commenting on it, but that one above has a mini review of it.


    I've personally only had one bottle of it. It was very good, but I guess not enough to drive me to get it again. Maybe I should revisit it. I do like Makers Manhattans (and enjoy it on rocks too). The 46 is costly enough IMO to warrant strictly neat or rocks in my drinking routine (*routine*? Man that sounds bad.)

    Ever try Buffalo Trace? It's my current favorite affordable bourbon. It's excellent!

    Leave a comment:


  • Brent k
    replied
    I have been drinkin Maker's Mark straight and Jim Beam for whiskey sours. I use fresh lemon juice and homemade simple syrup.

    Pretty sure I want to try Maker's Mark 46. Any reviews here on it?

    Leave a comment:


  • tdig
    replied
    Originally posted by yoyorobbo View Post
    Thanks tdig and Shomas. I'm not usually (OK, ever)a buy booze online kinda guy, but it's something to keep in mind, I guess for the hard-to-find stuff.

    On the rye-ish bourbons: Woodford is supposed to be a high rye bourbon too, right? It did taste a bit spicier(?) than a few other bourbons I like.
    I believe Woodford uses 18% rye which I would consider mid to high rye blend. Buffalo Trace has a low-rye mash bill (less than 10%) and a higher rye (12%-15%). The "Buffalo Trace" bourbon comes from their low rye mash bill also referred to as Mash Bill #1. Four Roses has ten recipes from two rye mash bills. Their OE line uses 20% rye and their OB line uses 35% rye. The Small Batch is a blend of OB and OE which puts it in the mid to high 20s and the standard single barrel is OBSV so 35%. The Limited Edition and Private Barrels are going to vary depending on the specific recipe.

    You'd be surprised how much difference a little bit can make with rye. To be considered a "rye whiskey" vs "bourbon" the recipe has to use at least 51% rye whereas bourbon has to have at least 51% corn. Some Ryes are on the low end and others are closer to 95% and higher.

    Leave a comment:


  • yoyorobbo
    replied
    Thanks tdig and Shomas. I'm not usually (OK, ever)a buy booze online kinda guy, but it's something to keep in mind, I guess for the hard-to-find stuff.

    On the rye-ish bourbons: Woodford is supposed to be a high rye bourbon too, right? It did taste a bit spicier(?) than a few other bourbons I like.

    I'm currently working my way through the bottle of Bulleit Rye from my b-day, and some Buffalo Trace bourbon. I really like that stuff!

    I'll probably hold out for some more Sazerac, if and when it comes back in at my local joints.

    Leave a comment:


  • tdig
    replied
    Originally posted by yoyorobbo View Post
    As far as Ryes go, I've personally only had bottles of Rittenhouse, Sazerac and Bulleit. My preference of those three is Sazerac, but it's near impossible to find locally. Once the *few* bottles are gone from the shelves, that's all you'll see for several months. Rittenhouse worked great in cocktails (mainly Manhattans and Red Hooks in my home bar XP) as it seemed to cut-through a little better; but for neat or rocks I really like that Sazerac Rye.

    Any other mid-low range offerings you fellas suggest? I hear Old Overholt all the time, but it's NOwhere to be found around here. I'd prefer to keep it around $30 and under.
    Ritt is my go to cocktail rye. I actually also prefer the Baby Sazerac for straight sipping but in all honesty I usually jump from cheap to expensive when I go from cocktail rye to sipping rye. For sipping ryes I currently have open 2012 and 2013 Thomas Handy, High West Rendezvous, Vintage 21, VWFRR, and EH Taylor Rye.

    Old Overholt is an average cocktail rye. Its $10 near me. Honestly there are not too many reasonably priced sipping ryes. The only one I would recommend is Willett Family Estate which is slightly above your price range considering youd probably have to have it shipped too. You are better off in the $30 range to go for a high rye bourbon like Four Roses Small Batch which is quite high in rye content.

    Willett Rye - $38 + shipping
    http://www.internetwines.com/rws47026.html
    Last edited by tdig; November 25, 2013, 02:47 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • Shomas
    replied
    Originally posted by yoyorobbo View Post
    As far as Ryes go, I've personally only had bottles of Rittenhouse, Sazerac and Bulleit. My preference of those three is Sazerac, but it's near impossible to find locally. Once the *few* bottles are gone from the shelves, that's all you'll see for several months. Rittenhouse worked great in cocktails (mainly Manhattans and Red Hooks in my home bar XP) as it seemed to cut-through a little better; but for neat or rocks I really like that Sazerac Rye.

    Any other mid-low range offerings you fellas suggest? I hear Old Overholt all the time, but it's NOwhere to be found around here. I'd prefer to keep it around $30 and under.
    A good option for buying booze that may not be available locally is drinkupny.com. Their shipping rates depend on what your order weighs, but it may be worth checking out.

    Leave a comment:


  • greg_s
    replied
    We just need a tdig beacon we can flash into the sky like Batman.

    Leave a comment:


  • yoyorobbo
    replied
    As far as Ryes go, I've personally only had bottles of Rittenhouse, Sazerac and Bulleit. My preference of those three is Sazerac, but it's near impossible to find locally. Once the *few* bottles are gone from the shelves, that's all you'll see for several months. Rittenhouse worked great in cocktails (mainly Manhattans and Red Hooks in my home bar XP) as it seemed to cut-through a little better; but for neat or rocks I really like that Sazerac Rye.

    Any other mid-low range offerings you fellas suggest? I hear Old Overholt all the time, but it's NOwhere to be found around here. I'd prefer to keep it around $30 and under.

    Leave a comment:


  • tdig
    replied
    Originally posted by ThatLarsenGuy View Post
    If i'm sipping n a Rye neat I agree with you, but if i'm making an Old-fashion I personally prefer lower proofs. Same with a Rye Sazerac. That's just me though.
    Definitely comes down to personal preference. In cocktails I try to use something BIB (100 proof) 99% of the time for both consistency and taste preference. Not too high to take over but not too low to get lost. With that said, I cant usually find any reason to spend more than $20 on cocktail whiskey either. Too many good options in that price range.

    Leave a comment:


  • ThatLarsenGuy
    replied
    Originally posted by tdig View Post
    To each his own. Never been much of a Templeton fan either. I enjoy some LDI rye's but I definitely prefer it at a higher proof than Templeton bottles it. Bit soft that low. I can't really get on board with an 80 proof NAS LDI rye at $40/bottle when I get get Bulleit for $18 or 110 proof Age Stated Willet at the same $40 price tag which blows the Templeton out of the water.
    If i'm sipping n a Rye neat I agree with you, but if i'm making an Old-fashion I personally prefer lower proofs. Same with a Rye Sazerac. That's just me though.

    Leave a comment:


  • tdig
    replied
    Originally posted by ThatLarsenGuy View Post
    Templeton Rye, the end.
    To each his own. Never been much of a Templeton fan either. I enjoy some LDI rye's but I definitely prefer it at a higher proof than Templeton bottles it. Bit soft that low. I can't really get on board with an 80 proof NAS LDI rye at $40/bottle when I get get Bulleit for $18 or 110 proof Age Stated Willet at the same $40 price tag which blows the Templeton out of the water.

    Leave a comment:


  • ThatLarsenGuy
    replied
    Templeton Rye, the end.

    Leave a comment:


  • Fred G. Unn
    replied
    The Hudson is honestly pretty pricey for what it is. I mostly picked it up since it's sort of local and relatives from out of town probably wouldn't have tried it before.

    Leave a comment:

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