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10k Kettlebell Swing Challenge

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    #16
    Hi Guys,

    Recently discovered Dappered and just signed up for a forum account so... first post!

    I'm a certified personal trainer and my day job is managing a spa and fitness center, if you've got any questions on swings or form I'd be happy to help out. Video is always easiest, if you can post a link we can check out your technique.

    Congrats to everyone attempting this challenge - Kettlebells are a GREAT full body exercise, and strengthen the posterior chain which helps counteract the effects of sitting all day.

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      #17
      Just noticed in reading this thread and checking out the T-Nation article that the KB swings are to eye level, or Russian, not the overhead, or American, swings. I go to a Crossfit gym for my workouts and we almost always do American swings, but it seems from the comments Dan John made in that article that he disapproves of overhead swings. Anybody know more about that?

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        #18
        Hi [MENTION=11125]burban[/MENTION], you'll hear pretty strong arguments on both sides. Adding the overhead component to a two handed swing does add some additional shoulder work to the movement, but the shoulder capsule is in a very compromised position at the top of the swing. It's possible to do injury-free, but wears on your AC and dramatically increases the chance for injury. If nothing else, to do it safely means using a lower weight than you could safely handle for a Russian swing.

        To be clear, we're just talking about swings. I go overhead with a 50lb kettlebell all the time for presses and get-ups. Personally I think american swings put a lot of risk into the shoulder joint for a not-that-effective shoulder workout, but like I said, it's debated on both sides.

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          #19
          The only reason that the "American swing" was introduced by the crossfit community was because it has a judging standard that is easy to implement in competition.

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            #20
            I do the Russian style 2 handed swings but not as many reps as you are planning. I have never tried overhead swings, but when doing the swing, I am barely actually using my arms, it is all in the hip pop. I usually do 50lbs and aim for 75 reps, and it is one of the most tiring exercises I have ever done.

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              #21
              Originally posted by Moelman View Post
              I do the Russian style 2 handed swings but not as many reps as you are planning. I have never tried overhead swings, but when doing the swing, I am barely actually using my arms, it is all in the hip pop. I usually do 50lbs and aim for 75 reps, and it is one of the most tiring exercises I have ever done.
              Pretty much this. Reason why Dan John disapproves of overhead swings is because he doesn't want any focus to be in the arms, and all the focus to be in the hips.
              [MENTION=12941]Moelman[/MENTION]: Did you get the 75 reps idea from Tim Ferriss? And how often do you do them?

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                #22
                Originally posted by devastitis View Post
                Pretty much this. Reason why Dan John disapproves of overhead swings is because he doesn't want any focus to be in the arms, and all the focus to be in the hips.
                [MENTION=12941]Moelman[/MENTION]: Did you get the 75 reps idea from Tim Ferriss? And how often do you do them?
                Yep, Tim was my introduction to them and a big influence in my interest in diet and fitness. On an ideal week I would do them twice a week on Monday and Friday and then do my lifting days in between. I would still do a few lifts on swing days, but usually a shorter workout.

                Highly recommend his podcast with Pavel Tsatsouline for strength advice as well to anyone. And on a related note, his episode with Dr Peter Attia is what inspired me to try the ketogenic diet, and I have lost 40lbs and down to around 11% BF.

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                  #23
                  I'm pretty sure resistance training, be it kettle bells or free weights, if done everyday will stretch out your muscles too much leading to injuries.
                  5' 6" | 143 lbs | 29x30 pants | 36S jacket | 14.5 shirt | 8 shoe size

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                    #24
                    Originally posted by AsianDapper View Post
                    I'm pretty sure resistance training, be it kettle bells or free weights, if done everyday will stretch out your muscles too much leading to injuries.
                    Depends on the work volume and the loads. Age and recovery time makes a huge difference as well. When I was in my twenties, I could work out every day and it wouldn't faze me. Now, in my mid-30's, I hit the gym maybe three times a week. On the upside, I don't have to work nearly as hard to maintain strength and muscle mass.

                    Also, haven't read all the responses, but I have a couple of things to add here:

                    - 5% BF loss in a month, give or take a couple of weeks is going to invariably lead to a significant loss of lean mass in most cases.
                    - Kettlebells are cool, but that workout is wack. If you're looking for long-term fitness results with an increase in lean mass and drop in BF, look to barbell based resistance programs coupled with a macronutrient based dietary doctrine. Ditch Men's Health workouts and the drivel you get from Bodybuilding.com.
                    - Take articles from T-Nation with a grain of salt. They have some good stuff in there, but also have a lot of nonsense; this workout is one of them. There's a lot of broscience on that site.

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                      #25
                      Originally posted by Moelman View Post
                      Yep, Tim was my introduction to them and a big influence in my interest in diet and fitness. On an ideal week I would do them twice a week on Monday and Friday and then do my lifting days in between. I would still do a few lifts on swing days, but usually a shorter workout.

                      Highly recommend his podcast with Pavel Tsatsouline for strength advice as well to anyone. And on a related note, his episode with Dr Peter Attia is what inspired me to try the ketogenic diet, and I have lost 40lbs and down to around 11% BF.
                      If you get a second, lighter kb you can end your lifting days with some swings. I do kb workouts with a 50lb bell but I have a 20lb bell that my wife uses. I like to end a barbell workout with some mountain climbers and a single set of 75 to 100 reps with the 20lb bell to really thrash myself.

                      That Tim Ferriss podcast with Pavel is GOLD. "What did you have for breakfast?" "Cow."

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                        #26
                        To the guy who quoted me and then deleted his post:

                        - It's not a barbell-centric program; Any real resistance programming worth its salt, especially for beginners, should be based on barbell training. If for nothing else, it allows novice lifters to build a strong base at which point then they can branch off and mess with their own programming; if that includes KB training, that's fine, but it certainly shouldn't be the starting off point for anyone. You're more likely to see better results squatting, pulling, and pressing consistently at heavy loads while watching your macro counts over the course of a month than you are swinging a kettlebell.

                        - Linear progression programs might be boring, but they work. There's a reason why most real programs for novices start with them. Also, if being entertained or "not bored" is what motivates you to work out, I think your priorities need to be adjusted.

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                          #27
                          Originally posted by Matchbook View Post
                          Also, if being entertained or "not bored" is what motivates you to work out, I think your priorities need to be adjusted.
                          FWIW, for those of us who work out for general health and fitness purposes, keeping entertained can be a big deal. I am physically lazy as hell and will find any excuse to skip a workout, especially if my routine has become dull or monotonous. So finding programs and routines that are at least somewhat engaging and enjoyable - which is sometimes as simple as finding something new to do - is a major factor in motivating myself to keep fit. Sometimes I'll get excited about running and do that pretty single-mindedly for a few months; sometimes I get into a very traditional powerlifting kick; sometimes I get a little crazy about HIIT for a while. Honestly, I'm happy to be doing anything that doesn't hurt me or bore me, regardless of what it is or how much "progress" I make doing it.

                          My fitness regimen is not goal-oriented, and I know I'll never be or look like any kind of "athlete." I just want to maintain my waistline and keep my heart pumping normally and hopefully look somewhat decent in or out of clothes.
                          Ben

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                            #28
                            Originally posted by LesserBlackDog View Post
                            FWIW, for those of us who work out for general health and fitness purposes, keeping entertained can be a big deal. I am physically lazy as hell and will find any excuse to skip a workout, especially if my routine has become dull or monotonous. So finding programs and routines that are at least somewhat engaging and enjoyable - which is sometimes as simple as finding something new to do - is a major factor in motivating myself to keep fit.

                            My fitness regimen is not goal-oriented, and I know I'll never be or look like any kind of "athlete." I just want to maintain my waistline and keep my heart pumping normally and hopefully look somewhat decent in or out of clothes.
                            Fair enough, but I think that to some extent, everyone's fitness regimen is "goal-oriented." Whether or not that's to look better, feel better, get stronger, build muscle, or what have you. That's the "motivation." The entertainment factor, I feel, should probably be a secondary or tertiary factor if you want to see optimal results.

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                              #29
                              Originally posted by Matchbook View Post
                              To the guy who quoted me and then deleted his post:

                              - It's not a barbell-centric program; Any real resistance programming worth its salt, especially for beginners, should be based on barbell training. If for nothing else, it allows novice lifters to build a strong base at which point then they can branch off and mess with their own programming; if that includes KB training, that's fine, but it certainly shouldn't be the starting off point for anyone. You're more likely to see better results squatting, pulling, and pressing consistently at heavy loads while watching your macro counts over the course of a month than you are swinging a kettlebell.

                              - Linear progression programs might be boring, but they work. There's a reason why most real programs for novices start with them. Also, if being entertained or "not bored" is what motivates you to work out, I think your priorities need to be adjusted.
                              This guy speaks the truth!

                              P.S. And I'm typing this after a grueling 25-min cardio, 35-min weight training and eating a bunch of tuna and rice with whey protein and milk to wash it all up
                              5' 6" | 143 lbs | 29x30 pants | 36S jacket | 14.5 shirt | 8 shoe size

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                                #30
                                I think kettlebell swings can be a great starting point for someone, as long as they practice proper form. It's one of the best bang-for-your-buck exercises, so it might appeal to a beginner more or just someone who doesn't want to spend a lot of time exercising, and anything that gets people into the gym is usually good.

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